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Name:	CD629 -	Reply
Subject:	Coal Mining at Smith Lake!!!!!
Date:	9/3/2008 9:40:57 AM

Hi there, you may know about this already, but just in case you haven’t heard, here’s the scoop. A company is currently applying for the necessary permits with ADEM to mine for coal in the Brushy Pond Area (Brushy Pond Mine). There was a legal notice in the Cullman Times in either July or early Aug. but we didn’t hear anything about it until one of our neighbor’s called us last night. There are 2800 acres involved and 110 landowners who are leasing their land to this company. We know for a fact that some of this land is right up the hill from Big Bridge, along 222 (towards the 4-way) and based on what we’ve heard it extends into some of the Cold Springs Area and towards Brushy Pond Rest. Most people in this area are unaware of this, so we are trying to get the word out. ADEM is accepting complaints until September 15. The contact person there is Brian Marshall, 334-27;1-7895, email bmarshall@adem.state.al.us .

Please pass the information to anyone on Lake who isn't aware....

Here's the link the view the application:
http://www.adem.state.al.us/PublicNotice/Aug08/npdes/8national.pdf

Name:	Yankee06 -	Reply
Subject:	Coal Mining at Smith Lake!!!!!
Date:	9/6/2008 1:50:32 PM

WOW!!!! I would think this is big news! ..BAD news!
-you posted this three days ago and I find it hard to believe there are not already many more postings looking for, or suggesting ways to stop this from happening. Where are the lawyers when you need them? What do SLISA and Smith Lake Advocay group think?
-How does a mining deal like this get done without public notification and discussion? you would think that 220 people signing up would get to the press. Our politicians must be in on this.
-Or...maybe I'm getting agead of myself. maybe all this was out in the opening and I just wasn't paying attention. maybe everyone but lake dwellers think this is a good idea.
-What's everyone else think?
-

Name:	keyman -	Reply
Subject:	Coal Mining at Smith Lake!!!!!
Date:	9/7/2008 11:21:17 AM

SLISA has written a letter to ADEM and requested a public hearing on this matter.SLISA will inform by email and web-site the reply from ADEM when they announce the time and location of this hearing. Everyone should know that APC has contracted to buy this coal. It is important for everyone to continue to educate themselves on how to protect and improve OUR LAKE!!!

Name:	waterph -	Reply
Subject:	Coal Mining at Smith Lake!!!!!
Date:	9/7/2008 7:24:51 PM

Thanks for comments about coal mining. I personally would like to know more such as:
1. Is this surface mining or shaft mining?
2. How many acres if surface mining and how close to Smith Lake water?
3. The name of the coal company?
4. The level of involvement of APC in this project?
5. What type of environmental threats are involved?
6. What is the position of some of the local environmental groups toward this particlular project?

Name:	Bill -	Reply
Subject:	Coal Mining at Smith Lake!!!!!
Date:	9/8/2008 12:14:02 PM

Hey Jared.

I want to compliment you on looking into this.

Name:	Bill -	Reply
Subject:	Coal Mining at Smith Lake!!!!!
Date:	9/8/2008 12:17:45 PM

My understanding is that this is strip mining. I don't know much about that sort of thing, but it has been going on here for decades. There are countless acres of horribly scarred land. It makes the entire area look terrible. No one really cared back in the day... but now that more and more people are living here things are different.

I'm not sure of what the environmental impact is though. It doesn't seem to have had much effect over the last decades of mining. But it should be monitored I'd think.

It just looks really ugly.

Name:	waterph -	Reply
Subject:	Coal Mining at Smith Lake!!!!!
Date:	9/8/2008 8:49:14 PM

I recently went to Black Warrior Riverkeeper's web site and reviewed issue 11 of the winter 2008 issue from Black Warrio Riverkeeper. This article addresses some of the environmental issues with strip mining of coal close to a major warrior source supplying drinking water to a major metropolitan area. I copied the first part of the article for reiew on this forum.

"Shepherd Bend Mine: Threat to Birmingham Water Supply

Shepherd Bend Mine, a proposed coal mine along the Black Warrior River’s Mulberry Fork, is right across the river from the Birmingham Water Works Board's drinking water intake. Putting a massive 1,773 acre strip mine adjacent to one of Birmingham’s major drinking water intakes is ludicrous. This mine proposes 29
wastewater outfalls into the river and its tributaries.

The entity applying for this mine's wastewater discharge permit through ADEM is Shepherd Bend, LLC. Its Managing Member, Donald M. Baxter, is also the Managing Member of Quinton Mining, LLC, which violated its discharge permit at another mine in the same area over 200 times in 2005 and 2006. ADEM’s fine was a mere slap on the wrist. Paying ADEM’s meager fines is a small cost of doing business compared to the cost of installing proper pollution controls.

There is every reason to believe permit compliance will be an issue at Shepherd Bend Mine as well. When a coal strip mine violates its permit, high amounts of total suspended solids, or muddy water, and heavy metals such as iron, aluminum, and manganese, among other pollutants, are discharged.

If there is a location where a coal mine should be denied a permit, this is it. Our drinking water is too important. The Mulberry Fork supplies Birmingham with tens of millions of gallons of water each day.

Watershed protection is the key component to a healthy water supply, especially for the land immediately adjacent to the water intake. Once watershed protections are lost and pollution is inevitable, chemical treatment of the water becomes necessary. It is much more costly to treat polluted water than clean water. The Birmingham Water Works is concerned about this mine’s potential to pollute our water and raise treatment costs."

What will be the scenario for Smith Lake if ADEM approves this project? Will the environmental changes from coal mining be exponential when added to the large changes already seen from lake level shifts due to cooling water for Gotgas from June to September?

Name:	CD629 -	Reply
Subject:	Coal Mining at Smith Lake!!!!!
Date:	9/9/2008 9:16:55 AM

check out the application for details of locations (coon creek, ryan creek, alder branch).

http://www.adem.state.al.us/PublicNotice/Aug08/npdes/8national.pdf

A total of 2800 acres are involved in this project and it will be surface strip mining which if your interested in what the land looks like after post mining just take a drive down CO. RD 202 or 201 towards Lake Shore West. Most of the land is now used for pasture after several years of adding dirt to make it usable land.

The permit is filed under William Snodgrass; Chief Operating Officer of National Coal of Alabama.

Name:	CD629 -	Reply
Subject:	Coal Mining at Smith Lake!!!!!
Date:	9/9/2008 9:49:49 AM

here's a link to the location of the mine in brushy creek.

http://www.topozone.com/map.asp?lon=-87.051394&lat=34.0167696&datum=nad83

Name:	Yankee06 -	Reply
Subject:	Coal Mining at Smith Lake!!!!!
Date:	9/9/2008 11:17:26 AM

-Does anyone know if there is an impact statment for this mine on Smith Lake?

Name:	turnipgreen -	Reply
Subject:	Coal Mining at Smith Lake!!!!!
Date:	9/10/2008 4:40:51 PM

I'm torn on this.

I actually think they did a pretty good job reclaiming the land down 201/202, but I didn't see it more than 4 years ago, so maybe it had been bad for a while. Just because it is pasture doesn't mean it isn't useful, it usually just means that is what the owner decided to do with it.

Also, it is pretty hard for most of us to criticize muddy water runoff as a major sin, since there seems to be no control over runoff from land clearing on the lake edge for new home development, and I've seen some that have caused a ton of runoff.

Now, knowing that some mining projects probably violate the rules knowing that it won't cost much is a problem. Seems like stiffer fines should be in place. But if there is a way to mine the coal and not cause damage to the local environment, it is reclaimed properly, and the land owners want to allow it, I guess I don't see the problem.

Ron (and no, I don't work for Alabama Power, or a coal mine, although my sister does work for Alabama Power, and my dad was a coal miner that retired 20 years ago)

Name:	TubeMan -	Reply
Subject:	Coal Mining at Smith Lake!!!!!
Date:	9/17/2008 1:19:54 PM

Correct Turnipgreen. There is far more damage being done by all the clearing that is being done on or near the lake. We see homesite after homesite where the owner has completely removed everything but the dirt (or mud) from their lot. Erosion screens are minimally effective in controlling soil discharge into the lake. We are against the mine and the subsequent discharge issues that will follow, but we as lake front owners (developers included) should get our own act in order also. Thanks for the contact phone numbers> we will be making some calls voicing our opposition to the mine.

Name:	skimalibu -	Reply
Subject:	Coal Mining at Smith Lake!!!!!
Date:	9/17/2008 3:35:20 PM

You guys are spot on about the run off from cleared property. We completed our house last summer with minimal disruption near the lake. We still had major sediment runoff which found itself conviently located under my dock. Upon giving the builder grief about not spending the erosion control money, he informed me that I was the first person to ever give him a hard time about not managing the runoff. I have a little experience in NPDES inspections and the methods being used on the lake are critically inadequate. The topography is a huge challenge and requires more than a layer or two of sediment fencing.

With all of this said, does anyone in the county approve erosion control plans and then follow up to make sure that they are being followed and managed? As these big, subdivision type developments come in this is going to become a major need. The mine is no different.

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